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Author Topic: Military will write the rules on DADT repeal  (Read 2066 times)

Offline Wildman78

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Military will write the rules on DADT repeal
« on: December 21, 2010, 11:53:07 AM »
WASHINGTON — No public displays of affection. No separate bathrooms. No harassment and no special treatment.

As the military begins to map out how it will implement the new edict allowing gays to serve openly, the first order of business is drafting the regulations. The rule changes under discussion won't dictate how troops feel about the change, but will strictly enforce how they act on it.

From small wording tweaks and training programs to more complex questions about benefits and religion, the proposed guidelines demand that gays and lesbians be treated just like any other soldier, sailor, airman or marine. But they also leave the door open for some flexibility in room assignments or other instances when commanders believe it's needed to maintain order and discipline in their units.

The Senate voted Saturday to repeal the ban on openly gay service, following earlier action by the House. Fulfilling a 2008 campaign promise, President Barack Obama plans to sign the bill into law Wednesday at a Department of Interior ceremony. But in letters to the troops over the weekend, the four military service chiefs warned that the ban is still in place, and will be for some time to come.

............................

In some cases, service members may be able to designate a same-sex partner for benefits. In most cases, however, they are treated much like unmarried heterosexual couples. So, same-sex partners will probably not be able to share on-base housing, and commanders don't have to make allowances for same-sex couples when making duty assignments around the globe

http://www.militarytimes.com/news/2010/12/ap-obama-plans-to-sign-repeal-of-dadt-122010/

Offline Strike79

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Re: Military will write the rules on DADT repeal
« Reply #1 on: December 21, 2010, 12:42:55 PM »
Wildman and board:

Do any of you guys think the boys running the military will consult with ole spot while writing the rules on DADT repeal?

Ole spot seems to have STRONG opinions on the matter, so maybe he wants some input on how this whole repeal thing goes down.  :lol:

Offline Que82

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Re: Military will write the rules on DADT repeal
« Reply #2 on: December 21, 2010, 12:51:04 PM »
Thanks for this article Wildman78.  I kept telling folks the DOD wanted it repealed so they can keep control of it.  These new regulation will be worded so constitutional challenges will be limited. The court ruling may have opened Pandora's box.  :nod:
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Offline j1908

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Re: Military will write the rules on DADT repeal
« Reply #3 on: December 21, 2010, 09:08:13 PM »
 
I think I will keep my personal views on the issue to myself like many other people who will only discuss this topic in the privacy of their own homes for fear that it may be used against them--and that goes for whether you support or don't support repealing the policy.
 
I have great concern about how this whole process is going to happen.  On US soil I don't think we will have issues, but in deployed locations and in certain units, I think there may be some turmoil.
 
I truly believe that most people including military people don't really care that much about what you do in your bedroom.  The issue comes when you want to share that information with others, whether heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual, etc.  And, really, isn't that what repealing don't ask don't tell is going to do.  It is going to open up some people's bedrooms.  Although clearly, hetersosexual people have been open with who they are sleeping with if they are married, it's assumed you are having sex with your spouse.  Anyway...
 
Here are some concerns I have.
 
Harassment....They are clearly homophobic people in the military.  And, there are clearly some crazy folks.  How many people fall into both groups, who knows.  But, I can see people who want to be "open" about their sexuality may get some harassment, whether substantiated or not.  Trust that females who are loose get their share of differential treatment.  But, also, I am concerned about people who are Christian who believe that homosexuality is a sin.  A line is going to have to be drawn about what can and cannot be said because the Senate has now said this is acceptable behavior.  Will Christians who say this is wrong now be the subject of EO complaints and such????

Integration/Separation...I too wonder what is going to happen at balls and even ceremonies like promotions and retirements where the kiss from the significant other is currently acceptable if not encouraged.  What about living arrangements?  For the young enlisted troops who must live in the dorms and share a common area, will they have any say?  What about the gym locker rooms??  Generally, men and women are separated for bathroom and sleeping areas.  I would think this is to separate people who are potentially attracted to each other even though not every man and woman are trying to have sex with each other.  How will this change with people who are openly homosexual?  Should it even matter?
 
Men have been killed in the past for being thought to be gay.  Maybe being open about it will make people talk about it or maybe it will make people act out.  I don't know, but I do know that I am concerned and I hope that our military leaders take a thoughtful approach to implementing this new policy.
 
Your friendly active duty Mental Health officer who hopes her thoughts are never used against her,
Jackie with an IE
WE ARE ALL  IMPORTANT BUT I AM FASCINATING !!!!!

Offline Que82

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Re: Military will write the rules on DADT repeal
« Reply #4 on: December 21, 2010, 09:16:34 PM »
J I think they will tighten regs which will discourage open displays of affection for all.  I don't think Congress was okaying the behavior, I think they were keeping a court ruling from tying their hands.  Do any of the legal beagles think I'm too far off the mark or I'm reading this wrong?
« Last Edit: December 22, 2010, 04:28:15 PM by Que82 »
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Offline Wildman78

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Re: Military will write the rules on DADT repeal
« Reply #5 on: December 21, 2010, 09:43:00 PM »
Read the entire article in the lead post. It appears that the military is  already thinking about how to handle the issues raised by j1908.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2010, 09:56:13 PM by Wildman78 »

Offline soflorattler

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Re: Military will write the rules on DADT repeal
« Reply #6 on: December 22, 2010, 06:12:05 AM »

I think I will keep my personal views on the issue to myself like many other people who will only discuss this topic in the privacy of their own homes for fear that it may be used against them--and that goes for whether you support or don't support repealing the policy.
 
I have great concern about how this whole process is going to happen.  On US soil I don't think we will have issues, but in deployed locations and in certain units, I think there may be some turmoil.
 
I truly believe that most people including military people don't really care that much about what you do in your bedroom.  The issue comes when you want to share that information with others, whether heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual, etc.  And, really, isn't that what repealing don't ask don't tell is going to do.  It is going to open up some people's bedrooms.  Although clearly, hetersosexual people have been open with who they are sleeping with if they are married, it's assumed you are having sex with your spouse.  Anyway...
 
Here are some concerns I have.
 
Harassment....They are clearly homophobic people in the military.  And, there are clearly some crazy folks.  How many people fall into both groups, who knows.  But, I can see people who want to be "open" about their sexuality may get some harassment, whether substantiated or not.  Trust that females who are loose get their share of differential treatment.  But, also, I am concerned about people who are Christian who believe that homosexuality is a sin.  A line is going to have to be drawn about what can and cannot be said because the Senate has now said this is acceptable behavior.  Will Christians who say this is wrong now be the subject of EO complaints and such????

Integration/Separation...I too wonder what is going to happen at balls and even ceremonies like promotions and retirements where the kiss from the significant other is currently acceptable if not encouraged.  What about living arrangements?  For the young enlisted troops who must live in the dorms and share a common area, will they have any say?  What about the gym locker rooms??  Generally, men and women are separated for bathroom and sleeping areas.  I would think this is to separate people who are potentially attracted to each other even though not every man and woman are trying to have sex with each other.  How will this change with people who are openly homosexual?  Should it even matter?
 
Men have been killed in the past for being thought to be gay.  Maybe being open about it will make people talk about it or maybe it will make people act out.  I don't know, but I do know that I am concerned and I hope that our military leaders take a thoughtful approach to implementing this new policy.
 
Your friendly active duty Mental Health officer who hopes her thoughts are never used against her,
Jackie with an IE

You are so on point, Maj. You've pretty much laid out the Pandora Box (as Que82 alluded to earlier) scenarios. This I do know... If you thought that you were working hard now, you ain' seen nothing yet. My having had training and certs in this field (Mental Health), I don't envy your job not one iota. I pray and wish you all the best...  :nod:

Offline Que82

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Re: Military will write the rules on DADT repeal
« Reply #7 on: December 22, 2010, 08:33:03 AM »
^^^^^^

J, Soflo makes a good point, your business might increase thus reducing your Onnidan time at work.  :lol:
Never discuss cheese with a rat, bread with a bird or make moves with a snake.

Lord, remove the front teeth of my enemies so I can know them by their smile.

Offline j1908

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Re: Military will write the rules on DADT repeal
« Reply #8 on: December 22, 2010, 09:39:23 AM »
Q, I can't have that^^^^ :lol:
WE ARE ALL  IMPORTANT BUT I AM FASCINATING !!!!!

Offline Que82

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Re: Military will write the rules on DADT repeal
« Reply #9 on: December 22, 2010, 02:57:53 PM »
Q, I can't have that^^^^ :lol:

Here's how it will go down.

Pvt Out of the Closet..........Maj (P) J, I keep having this desire to wear a dress in formation what should I do.

Maj(P) J......... (Looks at her watch, hasn't posted on Onnidan all day). Put it on with a note on the back that says, CG's B@tch.  Next!!!!

Sgt.  Macho.............. Maj(P) J,  I don't want no fags in my unit. I hate fags.

Maj(P) J......... (Looks at watch again) Go to the school board meeting in Clarksville, wave your empty weapon & yell I hate fags.  Next!!!!!!

Maj (P) J ............ (Looks at watch, stomach growls, eats bowl of chili)Attempts to log on Onnidan when CG walks into office.

Fade to Maj(P) J at  Fort Greely.......dayum I lost the internet connection again.


P.S. Did you notice the (P), speak it as if its so. :nod:  By the way when do you go up for it?  PM me.
Never discuss cheese with a rat, bread with a bird or make moves with a snake.

Lord, remove the front teeth of my enemies so I can know them by their smile.

Offline Golden Kitten

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Re: Military will write the rules on DADT repeal
« Reply #10 on: December 22, 2010, 04:14:01 PM »
Interesting perspective Soror... :nod:


Teeny and Little

Offline Strike79

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Re: Military will write the rules on DADT repeal
« Reply #11 on: December 22, 2010, 06:07:16 PM »
...
Men have been killed in the past for being thought to be gay.  Maybe being open about it will make people talk about it or maybe it will make people act out.  I don't know, but I do know that I am concerned and I hope that our military leaders take a thoughtful approach to implementing this new policy.
 
Your friendly active duty Mental Health officer who hopes her thoughts are never used against her,
Jackie with an IE
I found your post to be very interesting, and there is much to which I could  respond.  But I thought this particular excerpt^^^^^^was especially compelling.

Because you are a self-identified "Mental Health officer," kindly explain to a brutha the "mental" reasoning that would cause an otherwise sane individual to literally "kill" someone "thought to be gay"?  Seriously, while I might understand a man or woman being "uncomfortable" around someone who expresses same-sex proclivities, what is the threat that would result in the person's death?

If what you say is true, and I have no reason to suggest that it is not, it seems to me that the much LARGER issue in the military is NOT the existence of secret or openly gay soldiers, but, instead, the existence of folks who need clinical intervention.  Again, if an otherwise perfectly "sane" individual is prone to KILL someone thought to be gay, it seems to me that it is the person harboring homocidal tendicies who poses the larger threat.

My suspicion is that someone who would literally kill someone because they are gay is, through the violent act of murder, trying to either suppress or deal with some issues, expressed or latent, that are activated by the presence of a known "gay" individual. Or, it could be the presence of the known "gay" might trigger a rage that has been dormant for sometime and which arises out of an unfortunate incident in someone's past.

I am not a mental health professional, so I look forward to your professional "clinical" response to the questions that your humble poster raises.  :)

Offline Que82

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Re: Military will write the rules on DADT repeal
« Reply #12 on: December 22, 2010, 06:33:13 PM »
...
Men have been killed in the past for being thought to be gay.  Maybe being open about it will make people talk about it or maybe it will make people act out.  I don't know, but I do know that I am concerned and I hope that our military leaders take a thoughtful approach to implementing this new policy.
 
Your friendly active duty Mental Health officer who hopes her thoughts are never used against her,
Jackie with an IE
I found your post to be very interesting, and there is much to which I could  respond.  But I thought this particular excerpt^^^^^^was especially compelling.

Because you are a self-identified "Mental Health officer," kindly explain to a brutha the "mental" reasoning that would cause an otherwise sane individual to literally "kill" someone "thought to be gay"?  Seriously, while I might understand a man or woman being "uncomfortable" around someone who expresses same-sex proclivities, what is the threat that would result in the person's death?

If what you say is true, and I have no reason to suggest that it is not, it seems to me that the much LARGER issue in the military is NOT the existence of secret or openly gay soldiers, but, instead, the existence of folks who need clinical intervention.  Again, if an otherwise perfectly "sane" individual is prone to KILL someone thought to be gay, it seems to me that it is the person harboring homocidal tendicies who poses the larger threat.

My suspicion is that someone who would literally kill someone because they are gay is, through the violent act of murder, trying to either suppress or deal with some issues, expressed or latent, that are activated by the presence of a known "gay" individual. Or, it could be the presence of the known "gay" might trigger a rage that has been dormant for sometime and which arises out of an unfortunate incident in someone's past.

I am not a mental health professional, so I look forward to your professional "clinical" response to the questions that your humble poster raises.  :)

Strike I can attest that what she is saying is not far fetched based on personal experience.  The military tends to draw a lot of so called macho men and some of them are not all there.  Like that idiot major who went on a shooting rampage in Texas or the marines that killed those people in Cali.  I had a known member of the KKK assigned to my pathfinder unit at Campbell. he didn't like having a black LT so he took a CS caninster and poured the crystals in my POV's air ducts.  I was coming through Chattonnoga going to a game in Atlanta when I cut on my air conditioning and went totally blind at 75 miles per hour. This was not just a prank but the intent was to gravely injure or kill me. I didn't find out who did it until after he ETS'd.  So there are nuts in the military.  Some even post on here.  :lol:
« Last Edit: December 22, 2010, 06:44:43 PM by Que82 »
Never discuss cheese with a rat, bread with a bird or make moves with a snake.

Lord, remove the front teeth of my enemies so I can know them by their smile.

Offline Strike79

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Re: Military will write the rules on DADT repeal
« Reply #13 on: December 22, 2010, 07:06:47 PM »
.........understood.  And thanks, bruh, cuz I really couldn't grasp the mentality of someone who would KILL someone who is gay.

And what happened to you is REALLY "f'ed" up.  I'm glad things turned out as they did, but MAN is that scary.  :o

Offline Wildman78

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Re: Military will write the rules on DADT repeal
« Reply #14 on: December 22, 2010, 07:35:40 PM »
.........understood.  And thanks, bruh, cuz I really couldn't grasp the mentality of someone who would KILL someone who is gay.

And what happened to you is REALLY "f'ed" up.  I'm glad things turned out as they did, but MAN is that scary.  :o

I can understand that there are a lot of crazy people in the military but they were there before DADT. Some Christians don't like Jews so what.  The military has been able to handled prejudice and crazy people in the past with regulations. I don't see why DADT should be different.

Do I think the transition to acceptance of Gays in the military will be smooth sailing? No. However,sometimes doing the right thing is hard. I'm confident that the military will be able to adjust to change.  They have done it before.
« Last Edit: December 22, 2010, 07:41:55 PM by Wildman78 »

 

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