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Author Topic: The Problem With Most K----s Here  (Read 8896 times)

Offline y04185

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Re: The Problem With Most K----s Here
« Reply #60 on: June 17, 2009, 04:06:15 PM »
i liked the black panthers.  growing up an army brat i had respect for them as a child.
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Offline oldsport

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Re: The Problem With Most K----s Here
« Reply #61 on: June 17, 2009, 04:09:46 PM »
i liked the black panthers.  growing up an army brat i had respect for them as a child.

Really. When I came back from Nam these monkeys approached me about some  dyam revolution. I thought they were a dyam joke. They ones I knew were dumb as chit and basically out right cowards when confronted individually. I basically told them to kiss my a--.

Offline Bison66

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Re: The Problem With Most K----s Here
« Reply #62 on: June 17, 2009, 04:32:17 PM »
if blacks fought like you claim why did we lose the right to vote.  why did jim crow become law.  why did blacks allow whites to take over north carolina by barrel of a gun.  a strike here and a protest there ain't fighting.

First, y04, let me rephrase your question the way I am sure you meant to put it:

Since, Bison66, you have proven beyond a doubt that Black folks did fight in various ways (and completely destroyed my argument in the process), and since I realize that fighting back does not always guarantee victory, why did we not win?
y04185


There.....I fixed it all up for you.   ;)

Well, y04, there are many reasons.  Some are internal and some are external.

As is usual amongst people everywhere in the world, there would have been disagreements amongst us about how to proceed - whether to fight or not; how to go about it; use weapons or not, etc.  Consequently, all Black folks would not have been down with the struggle.  [Just like some American colonists were not down with the revolution, some Spaniards were not down to battle against the Moors, some white South Africans were not down with the apartheid government, some Portuguese were not down with their govt's colonial wars, some French-speaking Canadians were not down with separatism, some abortion foes are not down with bombing clinics, some Jews are not down with Zionism, some Muslims are not down with Jihad, some Alaskans are not down with secession, etc.]

Externally, there were several FACTS which would have made a successful struggle difficult under almost any circumstances, including a fairly united Black populace:
- Black people were a minority numerically
- white people had more weapons, partially as a result of the attacks on Black militias and determined efforts to disarm Black folks, legally and extra-legally
- white people had more military experience (Confederate Army vets)
- once partially disarmed, Black folks were more easily intimidated by Night Riders, KKK and Knights of the White Camelia
- BOTH** major political parties abandoned Black folks and permitted the "planter class' to re-take control after Reconstruction was killed
- the SCOTUS invalidated the Civil Rights Act, which allowed the infringement on voting and civil rights of Blacks by the white majority
- in the wake of the fall of Reconstruction, the majority ruled and the majority voted out Blacks' (and some poor whites') rights in many different ways (poll taxes, grandfather clauses, etc.)[/center]

I am sure there are other reasons as well.  But none of them contradicts the FACT that Black folks DID fight, resist and struggle.

I hope that is helpful.

 O0
**With an edit I will come back to cross post info on the betrayal of Black folks by the Party of Lincoln.
EDIT:
Quote
The decline and demise of the First Reconstruction grew apparent before the Panic of 1873 and the economic recession which lasted for four years afterward.  Northern capitalists recognized that they did not have to condone biracial rule in the South in order to develop the predominantly rural region.  Conservatives in the Republican Party found that their own interests converged with those of the former planter class to a greater extent than they did with poor blacks.  As historian Lawrence Goodwyn observes, “the bankers, manufacturers, shippers, and merchants” who ran the Republican Party “soon wearied of their attempt to build a postwar party in the South based on black suffrage.  As elected victories in the 1860s and 1870s proved that the [Republicans] could rule with a basically northern constituency, Negroes, their morale declining, and white radical abolitionists, their numbers thinning, lost the intra-party debate over Southern policy.”…..In the disputed presidential election of 1876, the Republican secured their narrow victory by promising to curtail civil rights measures and to allow the re-establsihment of white supremacy….
http://books.google.com/books?id=NjOPdGaoPKoC&pg=PA3&lpg=PA3&dq=black+reconstruction+in+america&source=bl&ots=OsJ7vq1T4u&sig=gyjLxjt23KW81zkwEmraqPaLExo&hl=en&ei=jW04SsD1FtWEtwfJrZHaDA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=8#PPA8,M1
« Last Edit: June 17, 2009, 04:39:43 PM by Bison66 »

Offline y04185

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Re: The Problem With Most K----s Here
« Reply #63 on: June 17, 2009, 04:42:27 PM »
bison, in many areas of the south blacks were the majority.  yet, they still lost the right to vote.  they were denied the right to assemble except in church.  they were denied an education.  they could not even own or purchase property.  they had negro wages and negro prices.  how did that happen in areas that had a black majority.
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Offline FunCkMaster

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Re: The Problem With Most K----s Here
« Reply #64 on: June 17, 2009, 04:56:37 PM »
Because as soon as the Brothers and sisters would have won an uprising pre 1861, Richmond would have sent a rack of soldiers to do what they did all through the South pre-civil war..Kill Kill Kill the black folks. Y, you are way smarter than that brah. You remind me of Eddie Murphy back in the day, talkin bout what black folks in the 80's would say to some slavemaster if THEY were slaves back in those days..

"I wish a *(*&^% would tell me to bail some Cotton, I would *&%$ him up!"

RIIIIIIIIIIIGHT..Black folks did what they could back in those days, as you all have explained stories of brief victories and uprisings. What finally gave the Southern Black folks even just a glimmer of hope for the future was the North kickin the South in the hindpots...
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Offline y04185

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Re: The Problem With Most K----s Here
« Reply #65 on: June 17, 2009, 05:09:46 PM »
funck, you know good and well i am not talking about slaves.  i am talking about free blacks.  you bringing up anything prior to slaves being free is moot.
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Offline Bison 4 Life

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Re: The Problem With Most K----s Here
« Reply #66 on: June 17, 2009, 05:28:22 PM »
i liked the black panthers.  growing up an army brat i had respect for them as a child.

Really. When I came back from Nam these monkeys approached me about some  dyam revolution. I thought they were a dyam joke. They ones I knew were dumb as chit and basically out right cowards when confronted individually. I basically told them to kiss my a--.

I know this is a flat out lie.

Offline FunCkMaster

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Re: The Problem With Most K----s Here
« Reply #67 on: June 17, 2009, 05:34:28 PM »
funck, you know good and well i am not talking about slaves.  i am talking about free blacks.  you bringing up anything prior to slaves being free is moot.

Okay, maybe I mistook the time frame. Still, come on, post civil war, you know darned well black folks were between a rock and a hard place. And we fought where we could. Shoot, just fast forward to now. All you need is for there to be a RUMOR about Black folks uprising against some injustices, and we'd fill the jails  a 1,000-fold...Ask the Black Panthers what happened to them when they just tried to make black folks on the left coast self aware, defend temselves the way other did, and do what you admire so much "Do for self". The doggone Oakland Police basically just did what they wanted to with Newton and a bunch of those guys (Lil Bobby Hutton etc.)
« Last Edit: June 17, 2009, 05:37:52 PM by FunCkMaster »
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Offline y04185

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Re: The Problem With Most K----s Here
« Reply #68 on: June 17, 2009, 06:26:25 PM »
funck, the people the black panthers were helping had the courage of sheep.  nobody took up the banner.
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Offline Bison66

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Re: The Problem With Most K----s Here
« Reply #69 on: June 17, 2009, 11:29:56 PM »
bison, in many areas of the south blacks were the majority.  yet, they still lost the right to vote.  they were denied the right to assemble except in church.  they were denied an education.  they could not even own or purchase property.  they had negro wages and negro prices.  how did that happen in areas that had a black majority.

Whereas, it has been indubitably shown that Black folks DID fight - armed and otherwise - for their rights in the post-War South, and

Whereas, it has been acknowledged - by silence or assent-  that this is true by all the parties to this discussion, and

Whereas, SEVERAL factors - and NOT simply population numbers - were previously delimited which contributed by combination and synergy to the stripping of the rights of Black folks despite their imperfect efforts to fight for them, and

Whereas, it is each person's responsbility to educate themselves on their own People's History.

BE IT SOLEMNLY RESOLVED THAT, except for those who choose a willing blindness, each person - rather than rely on others' research - commit themselves to learning more about their People's History so that their questions will be answered.

Respectfully Submitted in the spirit of PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY - and to derail any desire for being spoon-fed obvious answers - on this day, 17 June, 2009, the anniversary of the birth of James Weldon Johnson and the day before the anniversary of the death of David Walker.
 O0

Offline Bison66

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Re: The Problem With Most K----s Here
« Reply #70 on: June 17, 2009, 11:32:40 PM »
funck, the people the black panthers were helping had the courage of sheep.  nobody took up the banner.

Yep, one of them claims to have told the Panthers to kiss his a--!

 O0

Offline Bison66

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Re: The Problem With Most...
« Reply #71 on: December 20, 2013, 12:37:08 AM »
y04,

If you're still curious about this subject....

We Will Shoot Back: Armed Resistance in the Mississippi Freedom Movement

http://www.amazon.com/Will-Shoot-Back-Resistance-Mississippi/dp/0814725244

You can read some of the book on the Amazon site.

O0

 

 

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