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Author Topic: GOP voters win gerrymandering lawsuit forcing Maryland to draw new congressional  (Read 365 times)

Offline y04185

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democrats always cheating.

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Several Republican voters who accused Maryland officials of redrawing a key congressional district to illegally favor Democrats won their federal lawsuit Wednesday, in a sharp rebuke of overt partisan gerrymandering that forces the state to fix the problem before the 2020 elections -- or have federal judges step in and come up with a new congressional map themselves.
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Offline Wildman78

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Yeah right y04185, it's the Democrats that are always cheating.  ::)

Analysis: Partisan gerrymandering has benefited Republicans more than Democrats.

Associated Press
 
Jun. 25, 2017, 12:25 PM
 

The AP scrutinized the outcomes of all 435 U.S. House races and about 4,700 state House and Assembly seats up for election last year using a new statistical method of calculating partisan advantage. It's designed to detect cases in which one party may have won, widened or retained its grip on power through political gerrymandering.

The analysis found four times as many states with Republican-skewed state House or Assembly districts than Democratic ones. Among the two dozen most populated states that determine the vast majority of Congress, there were nearly three times as many with Republican-tilted U.S. House districts.

Traditional battlegrounds such as Michigan, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, Florida and Virginia were among those with significant Republican advantages in their U.S. or state House races. All had districts drawn by Republicans after the last Census in 2010.

The AP analysis also found that Republicans won as many as 22 additional U.S. House seats over what would have been expected based on the average vote share in congressional districts across the country. That helped provide the GOP with a comfortable majority over Democrats instead of a narrow one.

https://www.businessinsider.com/partisan-gerrymandering-has-benefited-republicans-more-than-democrats-2017-6


« Last Edit: November 10, 2018, 01:17:53 PM by Wildman78 »

Online JAG89

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Good...This just clears the way to redraw the many districts that were gerrymandered in favor of Republican candidates.  They used the Maryland lawsuit to hold up the other lawsuits.  Interesting that they waited right after the midterms to proceed forward.  It seems like the Republicans cheated way more than the Democratics.

https://www.apnews.com/0c5396b42627491c9f748ba8a75bf07f
« Last Edit: November 09, 2018, 12:11:22 AM by JAG89 »

Offline Ramese98

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Good, and interesting. When filing lawsuits and fighting in the courts using this precedent the Democrats now have this case on hand. A case won by the GOP,sometimes blessings do come in disguise. It is hard to argue against your own case.
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Offline Wildman78

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From the opening post:

The U.S. Supreme Court reviewed the Maryland case this summer before deciding in June to refer it back to the lower court for a decision, effectively allowing the 2011 map to remain in place for Tuesday's congressional elections.

The Supreme Court could take up the issue of partisan gerrymandering again this term, in a case from North Carolina. Republicans there have urged the justices to rule that courts should stay out of disputes about the political process.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/gop-voters-win-gerrymandering-lawsuit-forcing-maryland-to-draw-new-congressional-map-for-2020

As stated above the Maryland case was before the Supreme Court this summer, and the Court declined to decide whether partisan gerrymandering was unconstitutional.

Supreme Court Avoids an Answer on Partisan Gerrymandering

WASHINGTON — The Supreme Court declined on Monday to address the central questions in two closely watched challenges to partisan gerrymandering, putting off for another time a ruling on the constitutionality of voting districts designed by legislatures to amplify one party’s political power.

In a challenge to a redistricting plan devised by the Republican Legislature in Wisconsin, the court unanimously said that the plaintiffs had not proved that they had suffered the sort of direct injury that would give them standing to sue. The justices sent the case back to a trial court to allow the plaintiffs to try again to prove that their voting power had been directly affected by the way state lawmakers drew voting districts for the State Assembly.


In the second case, the court unanimously ruled against the Republican challengers to a Democratic plan to redraw a Maryland congressional district. In a brief unsigned opinion, the court said the challengers had waited too long to seek an injunction blocking the district, which was drawn in 2011.

Both cases had the potential to deliver a reckoning on a practice that dates to the early days of the Republic and got its name from one of the signers of the Declaration of Independence, Elbridge Gerry. The court instead kicked the can down the road, leaving the door open to further challenges.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/18/us/politics/supreme-court-wisconsin-maryland-gerrymander-vote.html



Offline thatd@mnYOGI

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Y, you are simple. They can redraw all they want. What they fail to realize the key point is the state assembly is Democratic and the majority of the state is blue. Good luck with that. The major counties in Maryland are Democratic. This isn't the south buddy despite it being below the Mason Dixon line.

that's all...   :lol:

Offline CIAA-FAN

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democrats always cheating.

Read more 

Several Republican voters who accused Maryland officials of redrawing a key congressional district to illegally favor Democrats won their federal lawsuit Wednesday, in a sharp rebuke of overt partisan gerrymandering that forces the state to fix the problem before the 2020 elections -- or have federal judges step in and come up with a new congressional map themselves.

HE COUNTS ON YOUR NOT READING THE ENTIRE ARTICLE.  I HAVE LONG SINCE STOPPED TRUSTING ANYTHING HE POSTS ON FACE VALUE.
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Offline y04185

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Yeah right y04185, it's the Democrats that's always cheating.  ::)

Analysis: Partisan gerrymandering has benefited Republicans more than Democrats.

Associated Press
 
Jun. 25, 2017, 12:25 PM
 

The AP scrutinized the outcomes of all 435 U.S. House races and about 4,700 state House and Assembly seats up for election last year using a new statistical method of calculating partisan advantage. It's designed to detect cases in which one party may have won, widened or retained its grip on power through political gerrymandering.

The analysis found four times as many states with Republican-skewed state House or Assembly districts than Democratic ones. Among the two dozen most populated states that determine the vast majority of Congress, there were nearly three times as many with Republican-tilted U.S. House districts.

Traditional battlegrounds such as Michigan, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, Florida and Virginia were among those with significant Republican advantages in their U.S. or state House races. All had districts drawn by Republicans after the last Census in 2010.

The AP analysis also found that Republicans won as many as 22 additional U.S. House seats over what would have been expected based on the average vote share in congressional districts across the country. That helped provide the GOP with a comfortable majority over Democrats instead of a narrow one.

https://www.businessinsider.com/partisan-gerrymandering-has-benefited-republicans-more-than-democrats-2017-6

Maybe you can explain why this district wasn't gerrymandering when the democrats made it.  When the GOP kept the district intact all of a sudden it was gerrymandered.

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Offline Wildman78

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Maybe you can explain why this district wasn't gerrymandering when the democrats made it.  When the GOP kept the district intact all of a sudden it was gerrymandered.



Oh that definitely looks like a gerrymandered district to me. I'm guessing it's a district represented by a Black person. If you identified the district and state, we could put things in an historical perspective. Then, maybe, we could have an intelligent discussion about gerrymandering and voting rights in general.

It appears that the federal courts are struggling with redistricting issues. If we reviewed the recent court decisions on redistricting we might be able to discern a pattern. On the other hand, maybe there are clear inconsistencies in the lower courts that must be resolved by the Supreme Court.

This thread took the turn it did because you made the intellectually dishonest statement that it is the Democrats that are always cheating.

I have no problem discussing the constitutional implications of racial and partisan gerrymandering. I find it to be a very interesting topic.

I'm glad you came back to the thread. I will delete the Forrest Gump gif.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2018, 07:44:19 AM by Wildman78 »

Offline y04185

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Wildman, that's what the 12th District in North Carolina looked like when the democrats created it in the 90s.  They were forced to change it.  They did slightly.  The district basically had little changes.  When the Republicans redrew districts they left the district relatively unchanged.  Then the democrats cried gerrymandering about ten years ago.  Now the district looks like this.

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Offline Wildman78

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Correct me if I'm wrong. I'm guessing when District 12 was first drawn, it was drawn to make sure North Carolina could elect a Black person to Congress. I believe there may have been another district, District 1, that was also drawn to favor the election of a Black person.

I'm guessing that the former District 12 was recently struck down because someone argued that by packing Blacks in one or two districts, it made it more difficult for Democrats to get in other districts. 


What is exactly is your beef. Where is the cheating?  :shrug:
« Last Edit: November 10, 2018, 01:29:45 PM by Wildman78 »

Offline y04185

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The 1st and the 12th was drawn by democrats. The 1st was redrawn.  The 12th remained basically the same.  They made a few subtle changes to the 12th. 

When the democrats were the majority they claimed the 12th wasn't gerrymandered.   When the Republicans kept the 12th intact the democrats claimed the 12th was gerrymandered. 

The big question is: Was the 12th gerrymandered when the democrats created it or was the 12th gerrymandered when the Republicans didn't change the district?
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Offline Wildman78

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The 1st and the 12th was drawn by democrats. The 1st was redrawn.  The 12th remained basically the same.  They made a few subtle changes to the 12th. 

When the democrats were the majority they claimed the 12th wasn't gerrymandered.   When the Republicans kept the 12th intact the democrats claimed the 12th was gerrymandered. 

The big question is: Was the 12th gerrymandered when the democrats created it or was the 12th gerrymandered when the Republicans didn't change the district?

I would say the district was gerrymandered both times, and the Supreme Court said has much.

North Carolina’s 12th Congressional District was originally drawn due to President George H.W. Bush’s Department of Justice mandating that North Carolina create a second “majority-minority” district under the 1965 Voting Rights Act.

Cases involving the configuration of District 12 have appeared before the Supreme Court five times. A historical summary of the first four cases can be found in the fifth case, Cooper v. Harris which was decided in 2017.

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/16pdf/15-1262_db8e.pdf

1. In Shaw v. Reno (1993(Shaw 1), the Court held that redistricting for the purpose of electing a Black representative could be violative of the equal protection clause. The case was remanded to the lower court to determine whether there was a compelling reason to justify the racial gerrymandering

 https://www.oyez.org/cases/1992/92-357

2. In Shaw v. Hunt (Shaw 2)(1996), the Supreme Court struck down District 12. The design of that “serpentine” district, the Court held, was nothing if not race-centric, and could not be justified as a reasonable attempt to comply with the Voting Rights Act.

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/16pdf/15-1262_db8e.pdf

https://www.oyez.org/cases/1995/94-923

3. Hunt v. Cromartie (1999), the Supreme Court reversed a lower court ruling that the drawing District 12 violated the equal protection clause. The lower court said the district court was unconstitutionally racially gerrymandered. The Supreme Court said the evidence relied on by the lower court was insufficient.

https://www.oyez.org/cases/2000/99-1864

4.  Easley v. Cromartie (Cromartie II)(2001),the Supreme Court upheld District 12 because it found that Racial considerations did not predominate in designing the revised District. Rather, District 12 was the result of a political gerrymander—an effort to engineer, mostly “without regard to race,” a safe Democratic seat.

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/16pdf/15-1262_db8e.pdf

http://www.lawschoolcasebriefs.net/2013/11/easley-v-cromartie-case-brief.html

It does not appear that the map drawn from the 2000 census was ever challenged.

The map based on the 2010 census was challenged in Cooper v. Harris (2017).

5. In Cooper v Harris, the Court found that when the Republicans redrew District 12 in 2011, the district gained some 35,000 African-Americans of voting age and lost some 50,000 whites of that age, its Black Voting Age Population increased from 43.8% to 50.7%.

In striking down the 2011 drawing of District 12, the Supreme Court found that race,not politics, was the predominant reason for the maps configuration.

I think what y04185 is really asking is why was it legal gerrymandering when the Democrats drew District 12, and illegal gerrymandering when Republicans drew District 12.

The easiest answer, although not entirely accurate, is because the Supreme Court said so.

A more accurate answer is a little more complicated.

The Supreme Court did hold that District 12 was unconstitutional gerrymandering when it was drawn by Democrats.

However, Democrats came back and argued that they weren't using race, they were using politics i.e. trying to get a Democrat elected. Note, the Supreme has never said political gerrymandering was unconstitutional.

When the Republicans drew District 12 in 2011, contrary to y04185's assertion, the Republicans made significant changes. The Supreme Court found this was racial gerrymandering and not political gerrymandering.

Again, I ask you y04185, where is the cheating?  :shrug:
« Last Edit: November 24, 2018, 02:34:52 PM by Wildman78 »

Offline Wildman78

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y04185, do you now have a better understanding about the history of court challenges to North Carolina Congressional District 12.

I certainly do.  :nod:

Offline Bison66

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Well done, Wildman.

Calling 'balls and strikes,' unlike y04's hyper-partisan one way street of blame.

Now that Wildman has laid it out, y04 will slink away....as usual.

FACTS are stubborn things..........


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