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Author Topic: "Why Hillary Clinton does not deserve the Black vote" by Michelle Alexander  (Read 6573 times)

Offline Strike79

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Re: "Why Hillary Clinton does not deserve the Black vote" by Michelle Alexander
« Reply #60 on: February 18, 2016, 06:58:33 PM »
 :lol:............absolutely FASCINATING exchange between you two, and the very last paragraph of B4L's last post^^^^^is illuminating.

Having read each of your posts, your humble poster believes at this point that you boys are now being redundant.  You both have articulated yourselves loud and clear on the issue.  And you both make meritorious points.

But, hey, if y'all continue, I guess I'll continue following, and offer commentary from a "neutral" observer's perspective.  Perhaps we ought to give your debate a name. Battle of the Bovine sounds appropriate.  :lol:

Offline Bison66

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Re: "Why Hillary Clinton does not deserve the Black vote" by Michelle Alexander
« Reply #61 on: February 18, 2016, 08:18:07 PM »
B4L,

Sounds to me like we are approaching this from very different perspectives, but I might be wrong.

Let me speak for myself.

I come out of the protest tradition starting during my high school years in NYC in the early 60's.  I never became a Movement person, but I continued with various protests over the decades, including against police brutality in Washington state in the late 60's and in DC with the "Enough is Enough" protest at the US Capitol when Mamadou Diallo's mother spoke and was accompanied by her HU Law School attorney who lived in Drew Hall with me. (Only his nickname comes to mind right now:  "Barbarossa.")  In between I was part of a community group that sat in overnight at Brookdale Hospital in Brooklyn because they weren't serving the community in which they were located.  They made changes.

I led protests against Cornell University investments in Gulf Oil (due to their investments in Portuguese-ruled Angola) and picketed Gulf stations to increase awareness and urging people to cut up their Gulf credit crads. A year later Cornell sold their stock. I picketed the South African Embassy and was one of those hundreds of Black men who blocked the 14th Street Bridge during morning rush hour to highlight and protest all the guns being brought into the District from Virginia.  I was the only one in a suit and tie and had no money on me for my fine. (I was DEFINITELY  a moment!!!!  LOL!!  And was 'delayed' getting to work at HU that day.)  Bernie McCain and Rev Willie Wilson were the titular leaders and held an overnight locked-door meeting the night before.  I nicknamed us "The Brothers of the Bridge."

SNCC workers and CORE Freedom Riders often did not have bail money.  The NAACP sometimes stepped to the plate for bail as did Harry Belafonte and other "celebrities' of that day to offset expenses including I am sure, bail.

I have been part of "actions" (and in one particular 'militant' organization) where the stated policy was "Jail, No Bail!!"  The school children in B'ham FILLED the jails with no bail.  The foregoing about 'bail' is to say DEFINITIVELY that your comment about no bail is not a 'make or break' one - as you seem to suggest - in regard to whether something is a movement or not.

So, based on all of that,............
IMO BLM is NOT THE movement; it is a part of The Movement.  
If you want to debate your recently-raised issue of 'moment vs. movement,' I'm the wrong person to have it with.  That remains to be seen.

For example, when those 4 A&T Brothers started the modern sit-ins in Greensboro it was a moment that BECAME a movement that flowed into the broader Movement.  Time will tell with BLM.

"Revolutionary" is a much over-used and imprecise term, but what Revolutionaries are you alluding to who DID make arrangements for bail and to whom you contrast with BLM to the later's detriment???

And who said that BLM is "Revolutionary"?
They don't seem to be identifying as such - unless I missed it. At the link you shared, they say:  "It (BLM) is a tactic to (re)build the Black liberation movement.  When we say Black Lives Matter, we are talking about the ways in which Black people are deprived of our basic human rights and dignity."  Pulley, who declined the WH invitation, uses the word "revolutionary," but not quite in that context.

Naw, Brother, I have the strong feeling that there is something else behind your obvious disdain for and misgivings about the BLM.  Could be wrong,.....

Maybe our perspectives are just completely different on what a grass roots organization does early in its development.

When you got the cell number for BLM's co-founder and "could have called", did you call her to offer assistance, suggestions or moral support?

But now after all that YOU have said were BLM's accomplishments, you say BLM is "not a force" on the same day they are invited to meet the President in the White House.

Strike, I do hope we broke "new ground" for your consumption and further comment.  :)

O0
« Last Edit: February 18, 2016, 08:20:35 PM by Bison66 »

Offline Bison66

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Re: "Why Hillary Clinton does not deserve the Black vote" by Michelle Alexander
« Reply #62 on: February 19, 2016, 12:09:45 AM »
I agree B66, and that is why we have to be the force to affect change.  We all know that forcing change isn't a one week protest.


Not sure, Aggie...

Are you implying that BLM has been a one week protest?

O0

BLM is more than a one week protest group for sure.  I don't criticize BLM because they are disperse with different local leaders with specific issues and demands so you have to be tuned in to certain cities to know what is happening beyond what you hear on the news.

I was listening to a video of the great historian, John Henri Clarke, he mentioned that not only does a Movement need protesters and artists but a political and social movement also needs builders and managers, too.  People who know how to plan, organize and build infrastructure, non-sexy things like building sewage systems, roads, water treatment plants, power plants, and buildings.  A movement needs people who can manage and run offices that provide services to its people; and need people who knows manage corporate finance, banking, entrepreneurship, and major businesses.

Serious people can make serious demands of politicians, expect positive results and make good on delivering the consequences to politicians when they fail to keep their promises or fail to make a hard effort to keep them.

AggieJa--,

Meant to respond to you.  Got all in involved with my Bison Brother.

I agree that it is way too early to be dismissive of BLM at this early stage.  They may turn out to be a flash in the pan, but while they are on the front lines advocating for our People and our Dignity, they DESERVE our support - moral support at a minimum.

When you step out there you get attacked from all sides - even from your own.  The folks on the fRight and Fox News are demonizing them and lying about them and the very last thing we need to do is - without good reason - to attack them UNLESS we are on the front lines and see something shady or unwise going on.

Thanks for lifting up Dr. John Henrik Clarke - one of greatest scholars and teachers.

Is this the video you were speaking of?
https://archive.org/details/JohnHenrikClarke-AGreatAndMightyWalk

O0


Offline Bison 4 Life

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Re: "Why Hillary Clinton does not deserve the Black vote" by Michelle Alexander
« Reply #63 on: February 19, 2016, 10:07:42 AM »
B4L,

Sounds to me like we are approaching this from very different perspectives, but I might be wrong.

Let me speak for myself.

I come out of the protest tradition starting during my high school years in NYC in the early 60's.  I never became a Movement person, but I continued with various protests over the decades, including against police brutality in Washington state in the late 60's and in DC with the "Enough is Enough" protest at the US Capitol when Mamadou Diallo's mother spoke and was accompanied by her HU Law School attorney who lived in Drew Hall with me. (Only his nickname comes to mind right now:  "Barbarossa.")  In between I was part of a community group that sat in overnight at Brookdale Hospital in Brooklyn because they weren't serving the community in which they were located.  They made changes.

I led protests against Cornell University investments in Gulf Oil (due to their investments in Portuguese-ruled Angola) and picketed Gulf stations to increase awareness and urging people to cut up their Gulf credit crads. A year later Cornell sold their stock. I picketed the South African Embassy and was one of those hundreds of Black men who blocked the 14th Street Bridge during morning rush hour to highlight and protest all the guns being brought into the District from Virginia.  I was the only one in a suit and tie and had no money on me for my fine. (I was DEFINITELY  a moment!!!!  LOL!!  And was 'delayed' getting to work at HU that day.)  Bernie McCain and Rev Willie Wilson were the titular leaders and held an overnight locked-door meeting the night before.  I nicknamed us "The Brothers of the Bridge."

SNCC workers and CORE Freedom Riders often did not have bail money.  The NAACP sometimes stepped to the plate for bail as did Harry Belafonte and other "celebrities' of that day to offset expenses including I am sure, bail.

I have been part of "actions" (and in one particular 'militant' organization) where the stated policy was "Jail, No Bail!!"  The school children in B'ham FILLED the jails with no bail.  The foregoing about 'bail' is to say DEFINITIVELY that your comment about no bail is not a 'make or break' one - as you seem to suggest - in regard to whether something is a movement or not.

So, based on all of that,............
IMO BLM is NOT THE movement; it is a part of The Movement.  
If you want to debate your recently-raised issue of 'moment vs. movement,' I'm the wrong person to have it with.  That remains to be seen.

For example, when those 4 A&T Brothers started the modern sit-ins in Greensboro it was a moment that BECAME a movement that flowed into the broader Movement.  Time will tell with BLM.

"Revolutionary" is a much over-used and imprecise term, but what Revolutionaries are you alluding to who DID make arrangements for bail and to whom you contrast with BLM to the later's detriment???

And who said that BLM is "Revolutionary"?
They don't seem to be identifying as such - unless I missed it. At the link you shared, they say:  "It (BLM) is a tactic to (re)build the Black liberation movement.  When we say Black Lives Matter, we are talking about the ways in which Black people are deprived of our basic human rights and dignity."  Pulley, who declined the WH invitation, uses the word "revolutionary," but not quite in that context.

Naw, Brother, I have the strong feeling that there is something else behind your obvious disdain for and misgivings about the BLM.  Could be wrong,.....

Maybe our perspectives are just completely different on what a grass roots organization does early in its development.

When you got the cell number for BLM's co-founder and "could have called", did you call her to offer assistance, suggestions or moral support?

But now after all that YOU have said were BLM's accomplishments, you say BLM is "not a force" on the same day they are invited to meet the President in the White House.

Strike, I do hope we broke "new ground" for your consumption and further comment.  :)

O0

Bison66,



BLM doesn't feel organic to me at this time.  But some folks started screaming on social media and was "granted" de facto leadership status without being vetted.Mistake number one. Mistake number two if this was a organizational movement there should be guidelines on how to interact with the media and  how to deal with situations when situations go south.It feels and appears to be an event to take selfies and run back to class and say they've done something. While at the same time the other side is criminalizing BLM via media surrogates like Hannity and the rest. I hope this does not happen but if one of the leaders are shot and killed , then what?

You ask do I have a bias against BLM. I do not. What I am angry about is that every generation or so we make the same mistakes  in trying to move forward. I blame the generation before me who bought into integration and either spoke little or refused outright to talk about how they overcame segregation or Jim Crow. I blame this generation for not knowing it history. South Carolina State,Jackson State and Kent State were not that long ago. Don't think it can't happen again. Many police departments pull  from the military for SWAC and other tactical units. I worked with infantry, special forces and other fighting units. I've seen the mindset. They dehumanize the "enemy". We can't even se how the  chess board ifs being set up because we are being distracted by bullcrap like Beyonce at the Super Bowl or Kanye West rants.BLM will be the Willie Horton of  2016.
Whoever is running on the GOP side will use BLM for a "law and order"  platform just like Nixon did in 68. Whats worse they either are not listening or no one is pulling them aside to tell them its a set up.
« Last Edit: February 19, 2016, 10:10:46 AM by Bison 4 Life »

Offline y04185

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Re: "Why Hillary Clinton does not deserve the Black vote" by Michelle Alexander
« Reply #64 on: February 19, 2016, 02:02:47 PM »
B4L,

Sounds to me like we are approaching this from very different perspectives, but I might be wrong.

Let me speak for myself.

I come out of the protest tradition starting during my high school years in NYC in the early 60's.  I never became a Movement person, but I continued with various protests over the decades, including against police brutality in Washington state in the late 60's and in DC with the "Enough is Enough" protest at the US Capitol when Mamadou Diallo's mother spoke and was accompanied by her HU Law School attorney who lived in Drew Hall with me. (Only his nickname comes to mind right now:  "Barbarossa.")  In between I was part of a community group that sat in overnight at Brookdale Hospital in Brooklyn because they weren't serving the community in which they were located.  They made changes.

I led protests against Cornell University investments in Gulf Oil (due to their investments in Portuguese-ruled Angola) and picketed Gulf stations to increase awareness and urging people to cut up their Gulf credit crads. A year later Cornell sold their stock. I picketed the South African Embassy and was one of those hundreds of Black men who blocked the 14th Street Bridge during morning rush hour to highlight and protest all the guns being brought into the District from Virginia.  I was the only one in a suit and tie and had no money on me for my fine. (I was DEFINITELY  a moment!!!!  LOL!!  And was 'delayed' getting to work at HU that day.)  Bernie McCain and Rev Willie Wilson were the titular leaders and held an overnight locked-door meeting the night before.  I nicknamed us "The Brothers of the Bridge."

SNCC workers and CORE Freedom Riders often did not have bail money.  The NAACP sometimes stepped to the plate for bail as did Harry Belafonte and other "celebrities' of that day to offset expenses including I am sure, bail.

I have been part of "actions" (and in one particular 'militant' organization) where the stated policy was "Jail, No Bail!!"  The school children in B'ham FILLED the jails with no bail.  The foregoing about 'bail' is to say DEFINITIVELY that your comment about no bail is not a 'make or break' one - as you seem to suggest - in regard to whether something is a movement or not.

So, based on all of that,............
IMO BLM is NOT THE movement; it is a part of The Movement.  
If you want to debate your recently-raised issue of 'moment vs. movement,' I'm the wrong person to have it with.  That remains to be seen.

For example, when those 4 A&T Brothers started the modern sit-ins in Greensboro it was a moment that BECAME a movement that flowed into the broader Movement.  Time will tell with BLM.

"Revolutionary" is a much over-used and imprecise term, but what Revolutionaries are you alluding to who DID make arrangements for bail and to whom you contrast with BLM to the later's detriment???

And who said that BLM is "Revolutionary"?
They don't seem to be identifying as such - unless I missed it. At the link you shared, they say:  "It (BLM) is a tactic to (re)build the Black liberation movement.  When we say Black Lives Matter, we are talking about the ways in which Black people are deprived of our basic human rights and dignity."  Pulley, who declined the WH invitation, uses the word "revolutionary," but not quite in that context.

Naw, Brother, I have the strong feeling that there is something else behind your obvious disdain for and misgivings about the BLM.  Could be wrong,.....

Maybe our perspectives are just completely different on what a grass roots organization does early in its development.

When you got the cell number for BLM's co-founder and "could have called", did you call her to offer assistance, suggestions or moral support?

But now after all that YOU have said were BLM's accomplishments, you say BLM is "not a force" on the same day they are invited to meet the President in the White House.

Strike, I do hope we broke "new ground" for your consumption and further comment.  :)

O0

Bison66,



BLM doesn't feel organic to me at this time.  But some folks started screaming on social media and was "granted" de facto leadership status without being vetted.Mistake number one. Mistake number two if this was a organizational movement there should be guidelines on how to interact with the media and  how to deal with situations when situations go south.It feels and appears to be an event to take selfies and run back to class and say they've done something. While at the same time the other side is criminalizing BLM via media surrogates like Hannity and the rest. I hope this does not happen but if one of the leaders are shot and killed , then what?

You ask do I have a bias against BLM. I do not. What I am angry about is that every generation or so we make the same mistakes  in trying to move forward. I blame the generation before me who bought into integration and either spoke little or refused outright to talk about how they overcame segregation or Jim Crow. I blame this generation for not knowing it history. South Carolina State,Jackson State and Kent State were not that long ago. Don't think it can't happen again. Many police departments pull  from the military for SWAC and other tactical units. I worked with infantry, special forces and other fighting units. I've seen the mindset. They dehumanize the "enemy". We can't even se how the  chess board ifs being set up because we are being distracted by bullcrap like Beyonce at the Super Bowl or Kanye West rants.BLM will be the Willie Horton of  2016.
Whoever is running on the GOP side will use BLM for a "law and order"  platform just like Nixon did in 68. Whats worse they either are not listening or no one is pulling them aside to tell them its a set up.

Do  you  think  they  would  listen  if  anyone  tried  to  tell  them ? 

The  GOP  will  not  use  Black  Lives  Matter  in  the  manner  you  described .   They  will  use  the  photo  ops  against  the  democrat  nominee.  We  know  the  democrat  will  do  nothing  for  Black  Lives  Matter .   I  doubt  there  will  be  a  Black  anything  plank  on  the  democrat  National  Convention  platform . 
Fayetteville State by choice. Bronco by the Grace of GOD.

Offline EB

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After the BS HRC pulled in the '08 election, there isn't a scenario where I could see myself voting for her... ever.  Her campaign played dog whistle politics putting out that photo of Obama in Muslim garbs and suggesting that he was a secret Muslim and wasn't born in the US.  I won't vote for Trump, either.  Anybody but those two.
“At @TheSIAC media day, they wouldn’t even give us a table. They said, ‘you might want to ask one of the other schools if you can have a place to sit.’” — Coach Quinn

Offline DAW912

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The  Black community needs its version of the Tea Party to move the political narrative. Black Lives Matter is not that vehicle. First its been hijacked and second its more reactive than proactive.  We need more than clinced fist photo ops.

But we also need the 2016 version of Roy Wilkins and Whitney Young's as well. A multi  pronged plan of attack.
Black America needs to revolt from the Democratic Party.  They have failed us on so many levels.  We should become Independents.  In doing so, we will gain political leverage and force both the Democratic and Republican Party( and the newly formed party after the GOP splits up) to add to the their respective platforms meaningful polices to address the issues we face that will empower us so that we can get off the government's tit.  
« Last Edit: March 04, 2016, 01:06:44 AM by DAW912 »
“At @TheSIAC media day, they wouldn’t even give us a table. They said, ‘you might want to ask one of the other schools if you can have a place to sit.’” — Coach Quinn

Offline Wildman78

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Black America needs to revolt from the Democratic Party.  They have failed us on so many levels.  We should become Independents.  In doing so, we will gain political leverage and force both the Democratic and Republican Party( and the newly formed party after the GOP splits up) to add to the their respective platforms meaningful polices to address the issues we face that will empower us so that we can get off the government's tit.  

I've heard people express these sentiments  too many times to count.  What is being said sounds good when you say it real fast, but it is short on specifics

Maybe you can answer a couple of questions for me. You say Democrats have failed us on so many levels. What should the Democrats have done for Black people or what specifically have Democrats failed to do for Black people.

Specifically what "meaningful policies"  would you add to a Democratic or Republican platform and what issues would those policies address.

While you all are thinking, please tell me what Democratic policy caused all the neighborhood convenience stores in the Black community to be owned or run by Arabs.

 

Offline Bison 4 Life

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Wildman 78 returns from hiatus and is going after everyone. :popcorn:

Until there is real campaign reform ,ir removing dark money this is the system you'll have. If Trump wins, I predict one of the Waltons from Walmart and other billionaires will run for higher office soon afterward.This will open the floodgates IMHO.

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Agree with Wildman--does the DEMO cause black folks to take money out of their community each payday , and drive 10 miles to hand it over to white folks, does the DEMO party cause black folks to spend there $ 1 trillion dollar income on cars, cosmetics and rims, instead of investing for the future.  Does the DEMO party cause black folks not to support their HBCU's , yet give billions of dollars each year to Rev. Cash, for his new Maybach and plane so they can get to the pearly gates???  The question should be what have black folks done for black folks.

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The  Black community needs its version of the Tea Party to move the political narrative. Black Lives Matter is not that vehicle. First its been hijacked and second its more reactive than proactive.  We need more than clinced fist photo ops.

But we also need the 2016 version of Roy Wilkins and Whitney Young's as well. A multi  pronged plan of attack.

Our politics need to become more sophisticated.  Only voting for the democrats and doing, nothing like holding politicians accountable, is keeping us in neutral.  Actually, it is moving us backward and hurting us.

Here is a about Mrs. Clinton.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2016, 08:47:46 PM by EB »

Offline Bison66

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B4L,

.................."Revolutionary" is a much over-used and imprecise term, but what Revolutionaries are you alluding to who DID make arrangements for bail and to whom you contrast with BLM to the later's detriment???

And who said that BLM is "Revolutionary"?
They don't seem to be identifying as such - unless I missed it. At the link you shared, they say:  "It (BLM) is a tactic to (re)build the Black liberation movement.  When we say Black Lives Matter, we are talking about the ways in which Black people are deprived of our basic human rights and dignity."  Pulley, who declined the WH invitation, uses the word "revolutionary," but not quite in that context.

Naw, Brother, I have the strong feeling that there is something else behind your obvious disdain for and misgivings about the BLM.  Could be wrong,.....

Maybe our perspectives are just completely different on what a grass roots organization does early in its development.

When you got the cell number for BLM's co-founder and "could have called", did you call her to offer assistance, suggestions or moral support?

But now after all that YOU have said were BLM's accomplishments, you say BLM is "not a force" on the same day they are invited to meet the President in the White House.....

O0

Bison66,

BLM doesn't feel organic to me at this time.  But some folks started screaming on social media and was "granted" de facto leadership status without being vetted.Mistake number one. Mistake number two if this was a organizational movement there should be guidelines on how to interact with the media and  how to deal with situations when situations go south.It feels and appears to be an event to take selfies and run back to class and say they've done something. While at the same time the other side is criminalizing BLM via media surrogates like Hannity and the rest. I hope this does not happen but if one of the leaders are shot and killed , then what?

You ask do I have a bias against BLM. I do not. What I am angry about is that every generation or so we make the same mistakes  in trying to move forward. I blame the generation before me who bought into integration and either spoke little or refused outright to talk about how they overcame segregation or Jim Crow. I blame this generation for not knowing it history. South Carolina State,Jackson State and Kent State were not that long ago. Don't think it can't happen again. Many police departments pull  from the military for SWAC and other tactical units. I worked with infantry, special forces and other fighting units. I've seen the mindset. They dehumanize the "enemy". We can't even se how the  chess board ifs being set up because we are being distracted by bullcrap like Beyonce at the Super Bowl or Kanye West rants.BLM will be the Willie Horton of  2016.
Whoever is running on the GOP side will use BLM for a "law and order"  platform just like Nixon did in 68. Whats worse they either are not listening or no one is pulling them aside to tell them its a set up.

B4L,

It's taken me a while because things have been hectic and you deserved a full response. I appreciate this dialogue.

Bro, you are IMO super-imposing a standard of judgment (set of criteria) on a mostly grass roots movement that is unrealistic and counter-productive.

First however, I think it only fair to review.

You began by saying that BLM had not changed the narrative.  When I responded with evidence that they had, then you said they haven't affected policy.
http://onnidan1.com/forum/index.php?topic=108518.15

Then, among other things you said they were "directionless."
I contended that they had a clear direction and that it was yielding results re: awareness and accountability for bad cops.
http://onnidan1.com/forum/index.php?topic=108518.45

You then shifted to highlight (or ?criticize?) BLM's founding by Black "queer women."
So?
And you claim (accurately, I am sure) that they've been infiltrated.
http://onnidan1.com/forum/index.php?topic=108518.45

I pointed out that ALL of our organizations have been infiltrated.
So, I asked you to speak to their accomplishments which I had pointed out.

Your response was that they haven't "changed human hearts" and you say that having cameras "in (your) book" does not stop cops from killing Black people.
But, Bro, those are IMPOSSIBLE GOALS.  The damn Justice Dept, even if they wanted to, can't do that (certainly not in a couple of years) and, as I pointed out, decades of protest, resistance, lawsuits, prayer, etc. have changed very few hearts IMO.
So, how would expect a grass roots movement to have accomplished those things - in just a few short years.

You said I dismissed your opinion, but your assertions followed NOT a general request for your opinion, but this:
Quote
BLM has highlighted LIKE NO ONE ELSE HAS the egregious violations of our rights and law-breaking by police and prosecutorial malfeasance.  In just a few short - very short - years, there has been a change and SOME bad cops are starting to be held accountable.  A few are even being indicted and a few convicted.  But it's clear to everyone that Black folks ain't sitting back no more while racist police violence and terrorism continue unpunished.

If BLM didn't do that, WHO do you think brought that about?

You had not responded....
So I re-posed my questions and you - rather than answer them - mention that BLM is meeting at the White House, but question whether all of them are BLM or instead local activists.  And, despite being invited, they "are not a force."

Since you made that distinction, I asked you if you were aware of ANY local activists who had distanced themselves from BLM.

You respond with a history of the "queer women" who started it, but do not cite any activist who says they are not BLM.
And you imply that "revolutionaries" always have bail money. 

First, I respond with "Who said BLM is revolutionary?"
No response
Second, that revolutionaries don't (always) deal with bail and ask you to cite those who did.
No response.
And I gave examples of NO BAIL as a tactic.
No response.

Then you say that BLM "doesn't seem organic" to you.
I don't know what that means, but..
Then your next set of criteria / criticism is that they don't have a coherent media strategy and they are all over the place with issues.

Bro, this ain't some rich corporation or long established bourgeois group like the Urban League with a full time staff, etc.   You keep setting up IMO unrealistic or inapplicable criteria which MOST Movement groups would fail to meet.  But you insist on beating BLM over the head for not meeting them.  SCLC, CORE, NAACP, Urban league - none of them - would have met ALL your criteria by which you criticize BLM.  And they became well-organized national groups with offices, budgets, grants, etc.
BLM is an amorphous, locally-directed grass roots group, NOT a well-oiled and long established national organization.

You continue by expressing concern about what Hannity is gonna say and claiming that BLM does not understand it is all a "set up."
http://onnidan1.com/forum/index.php?topic=108518.60

Let me respond this way:
Black folks' efforts at liberation have been scapegoated from the rebellion on the Amistad through Nat Turner, Vesey and Tubman and Douglass on up to Garvey, King, Kwame Ture and every group in between and since then.  That's the nature of the oppressor and our struggle.
If we don't protest, it's a "set up" IMO.
If we protest, it's a set up?  Is that what you're saying?  Or,.... we have to protest in only VERY socially acceptable ways (and with NO "selfies") and only after having our media strategy all laid out with professional-sounding spokespeople trained to "stay on message?"

Finally you say that BLM doesn't know their history.  But you also said you had a BLM founder's number, but when I asked if you called to offer info or assistance or insight, you said nothing.  If it's all a 'set up" why not call her and warn her?  Or, give her, as I said, some moral support at the least.  If you still have the number, send it to me so I can call her to CONGRATULATE HER!
Are you feeling me on this?

On one of the rare occasions that y04 is correct, he suggests she might not have listened anyway, if you had called. He's probably right. 
How would that co-founder of BLM know you weren't part of a "new" COINTELPRO calling to misdirect or disrupt BLM?  The only way would be for you to have told her (with references) of YOUR OWN involvements in the past and what you learned from that activism.  Still she might not have listened, but you would have given it your best effort.  Right?  But if you were not an activist and/or had no references - WHY should she listen to you?

Anyway,...........
Did the NC A&T brothers stop to consult with the generation before them before they took action. No, they didn't.

Did the Montgomery Movement do so before they launched the boycott? 

Did the Deacons for Defense say, "Hold up, let's do some research before we load up our shotguns?" 

Students at Howard in 1968 didn't seek out activists from the 50's and HU students in the 1989 take-over did not reach out to those who took over the A Bldg in 1968.

No, Bro, it don't work like that in The Struggle - not at the grass roots level.  There are no Ven Diagrams and firm hierarchical structures. People do the best they can with the information and resources they have and, as a result of their OWN struggle - not from sitting back criticizing - they learn how to do it better....or they don't.

Finally, I'll address your statement:
Quote
I blame the generation before me who bought into integration and either spoke little or refused outright to talk about how they overcame segregation or Jim Crow. I blame this generation for not knowing it history. South Carolina State,Jackson State and Kent State were not that long ago.
Nice!  I truly do not mean to be harsh, but you blame the generation before yours and after yours, but neatly your generation escapes scrutiny.  C'mon, Bro! 

I won't try to defend either of those two generations.  They certainly are far from perfect.  But I WILL point out that there are HUNDREDS of books written by and DOZENS of documentaries made about those who brought down the Colored signs of Jim Crow and ushered in the era of Black Power and Black Beauty.  There are still a few secrets, but most of the real story has been told.

Most folks - we all know it's true - are not gonna be involved in The Struggle.  It is ALWAYS the few who are willing to make the sacrifices, risk being put out of school or being maimed.  I don't know if you were among that few in your generation, but I think if you had been you would be more understanding of what is transpiring now with BLM.

BLM and others are putting life and limb at risk in the streets these days confronting SWAT teams with the mindset you mentioned.  If we aren't gonna join 'em in the streets, the least we can do is respect their efforts and courage AND lend moral and/or material support when and where we can.

Sorry to be so long.

O0

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