ECSU PLAYOFF CONFUSION

[WileECoyote06]

Looking at it again, and after my first cup of coffee. . . 

I think he means that their stadium does not afford them the space/attendance needed to break even or profit on the game after the bid and whatever concession is given to the NCAA. 

Really weird way to put it.  I prefer people making it plain. 

Furthermore, I'm amazed that Elizabeth City can put 2K-3K butts in seats in Durham county for the CIAA ship, but he can't count on 2K-3K butts in seats in Elizabeth City for a playoff game. . . even though they average over 4K a game.

[punchy]

Interesting turn of events. 

[NEIGHBORHOODSUPERSTAR]

WilE,
If that's the case, then should ECSU make themselves playoff eligible ever again

What will happen if there comes a time when ECSU has a season like Winston is now, where they are clearly the best team in the region.  Is the AD gonna ship them out  for every game too  

It's 2 days later and I'm still not happy with this weak-minded decision.  Some schools can talk a good game about wanting to do well in the playoffs......but the actions from their leaders don't mirror their gum-popping    

[Decks]

I think we're making way to much out of this. It would be good if this game was at ECSU but that's not the case and certainly no reason to raise the white flag. Sounds like we're already accepting defeat.  Good teams go on the road and win. I listened to the ECSU vs Delta State game and they certainly didn't lose because of location. They lost because of coaching and execution in the second half. The same factors that will likely determine the outcome of Saturdays game.  

[NEIGHBORHOODSUPERSTAR]

I think we're making way to much out of this. It would be good if this game was at ECSU but that's not the case and certainly no reason to raise the white flag. Sounds like we're already accepting defeat.  Good teams go on the road and win. I listened to the ECSU vs Delta State game and they certainly didn't lose because of location. They lost because of coaching and execution in the second half. The same factors that will likely determine the outcome of Saturdays game.  

I respectfully disagree to the white flag notion.  No one's saying ECSU cannot beat California-Pa.  Just do the  things to increase your chances of getting a victory.  The CIAA hasn't won a playoff game since 1993, when Hampton beat Albany.  And sad to say, but  the CIAA has ever beaten a non-HBCU opponent in the DII playoffs.    To me, this is all about progress.  The CIAA and its schools (just like the rest of our conferences) needs to do things that show we're moving in the right direction, such as winning a playoff game......when I see that we may be the chief antagonists to such possible progress, that bothers me.  

[Golden Kitten]

Here is the link for the Host Operations Manual for the D-II Football championships. I suggest you bookmark it for when this discussion comes up next year...

http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/ba752e8048a4aa839449b74c8af46e6f/Preliminary_Round_Host_Operations_Manual_DII_FB11.pdf?MOD=AJPERES&CACHEID=ba752e8048a4aa839449b74c8af46e6f

Since Mr. Tillar is on the D-II football committee, it would seem that he was quite aware of what is required and the university made its decision, hopefully, based on his knowledge and recommendation. If you're not a Viking, it is disingenuous to sit and second guess the decision don't you think?

  the manual, if you haven't already. Please alllow me to ask y'all to refer to pages 4-6 specifically. There is a lot of information there to digest. Perhaps after reading, some eyes will be opened...

[Jumbo97]

I think we're making way to much out of this. It would be good if this game was at ECSU but that's not the case and certainly no reason to raise the white flag. Sounds like we're already accepting defeat.  Good teams go on the road and win. I listened to the ECSU vs Delta State game and they certainly didn't lose because of location. They lost because of coaching and execution in the second half. The same factors that will likely determine the outcome of Saturdays game.  

I agree with Decks. This is a good barbershop or even messageboard discussion but ECSU (players and coaches) earned 60 more minutes of play with an opportunity to earn 60 more no matter where. Condemning the powers to be for their decisions and talk of they shouldn't even be participating is over the top with and especially without all the information used to in the process IMO.  

I give ECSU a 50/50 chance to win this game if they can play close to 60 minutes of their Delta State best or better, but a VUU type performance probably means a beatdown. This is without knowing how well they are prepared in terms of opponents scouting information, coaching, and overall conditioning.

[Capler]

I read the pages you pointed out GK, and I don't see how it makes much of a difference.  We all knew the Ncaa wanted a guarantee and that is what the rules allude to. I went there looking for some other  reason why  ECSU could not host, such as the stadium not having enough capacity, not enough locker room space per player... I feel ECSU officials were just lazy and did not want to put the work and expense into hosting. As SUPERSTAR keeps saying, if they did not want to go to the trouble they should do like Skegee and not participate. Folk need to stop beating the 'location does not matter' drum. The location is not the main issue here, it is about how you treat your players. You're sending a very strong message that you don't want to be bothered on their behalf. Yet those kids suited up and ran up and down that field  to give the administration and alumni something to cheer about.  In the end the university thumbed their noses at them by saying, 'you little suckers go on up there and bring us a win back', while they are laying on their sofa eating chicken and  throwing the bones in the floor.

I would have more respect for the college if they would come on out and say they did not want to afford  it. Who do they think we are by trying to dress it up by using the term 'no equity'? We all know what that means. "negative cash flow" The question is, have you ever make any profit off of a game?   Well there is that Down East Classic I suppose.

[Capler]

I think we're making way to much out of this. It would be good if this game was at ECSU but that's not the case and certainly no reason to raise the white flag. Sounds like we're already accepting defeat.  Good teams go on the road and win. I listened to the ECSU vs Delta State game and they certainly didn't lose because of location. They lost because of coaching and execution in the second half. The same factors that will likely determine the outcome of Saturdays game.  

I agree with Decks. This is a good barbershop or even messageboard discussion but ECSU (players and coaches) earned 60 more minutes of play with an opportunity to earn 60 more no matter where. Condemning the powers to be for their decisions and talk of they shouldn't even be participating is over the top with and especially without all the information used to in the process IMO.  


I give ECSU a 50/50 chance to win this game if they can play close to 60 minutes of their Delta State best or better, but a VUU type performance probably means a beatdown. This is without knowing how well they are prepared in terms of opponents scouting information, coaching, and overall conditioning.

I grew up around black folk who always talked like that and I hated it like hell. "Well they should stop complaining and be glad for..."  Instead of always going to the back seat, how about sitting on the front sometimes.    ECSU was wrong, I don't care how some of y'all spin it. I hope no other Ciaa school makes this mistake again. We are the laughing stock of the Ncaa DII right now.  And yes it is a big deal. I knew that 5 minutes after the pairing came out and looked at the seedings.

[truefootball]

Let me put it simple...there is a big a*s hole in the top of the press box where the coaches have to coach from. They put boards over it to cover it up for the CIAA teams...which was ok...but that won't work for a NCAA game...the school made the right call...a 4 vs. 5 match up is a wash...if we were talking of a 6 vs 3 then maybe you would have a point...they have the money to fix it...(state school, not private) just not the time to get it done before the game...

[Golden Kitten]

It's funny how folks can always decide what others ought to do with their money. How many of you are privvy to EC's budget and what they have/need to do for their students or facilities? For any of you to suggest that they should forego playing in the playoff just because they chose not to host is arrogant at best.

I'm sorry but black folks are too fickle - including some of you who are bumping your gums here. Let the temp be below 50 degrees or let it even pretend like it's going to rain. None of your sorry @zzes are willing to sit in the rain or the cold. That's the way most of us are - isn't that what y'all always claim? So EC is suppose to take a chance on fickle black folks and the weather? I don't blame them. Why should they lose money because they can't depend on their fans (or any of y'all)  to come.

As far as respecting them Cap, frankly they probably don't give a particular d*&% what you or anyone else thinks. How did you or anyone else get to determine what type of message is being sent to the team? Suppose it comes down to the choice of hosting the game (and possibly losing $) or providing books for the team for 2nd semester. The books should ALWAYS win out and perhaps THAT is the message.

Once again, we can't see the forest for the trees.   We are sitting in judgement of a probable budgetary decision made by this school and that's not our place - unless you are a Viking. We continue to want to sweep at the door of someone else when we need a vacuum at our own doors...  And Cap, I certainly hop that Shaw is NEVER put in this position. Then we'll see where the rubber meets the road.

[WileECoyote06]

I read the pages you pointed out GK, and I don't see how it makes much of a difference.  We all knew the Ncaa wanted a guarantee and that is what the rules allude to. I went there looking for some other  reason why  ECSU could not host, such as the stadium not having enough capacity, not enough locker room space per player... I feel ECSU officials were just lazy and did not want to put the work and expense into hosting. As SUPERSTAR keeps saying, if they did not want to go to the trouble they should do like Skegee and not participate. Folk need to stop beating the 'location does not matter' drum. The location is not the main issue here, it is about how you treat your players. You're sending a very strong message that you don't want to be bothered on their behalf. Yet those kids suited up and ran up and down that field  to give the administration and alumni something to cheer about.  In the end the university thumbed their noses at them by saying, 'you little suckers go on up there and bring us a win back', while they are laying on their sofa eating chicken and  throwing the bones in the floor.

I would have more respect for the college if they would come on out and say they did not want to afford  it. Who do they think we are by trying to dress it up by using the term 'no equity'? We all know what that means. "negative cash flow" The question is, have you ever make any profit off of a game?   Well there is that Down East Classic I suppose.

Cap  I---->HERE<----U

[WileECoyote06]

Let me put it simple...there is a big a*s hole in the top of the press box where the coaches have to coach from. They put boards over it to cover it up for the CIAA teams...which was ok...but that won't work for a NCAA game...the school made the right call...a 4 vs. 5 match up is a wash...if we were talking of a 6 vs 3 then maybe you would have a point...they have the money to fix it...(state school, not private) just not the time to get it done before the game...

So are they too embarrassed to say 'Our press box doesn't meet the standard required for an NCAA playoff game'?  They have to use words like equity?  Why was it okay for the CIAA teams?  You all weren't worried about other CIAA coaches falling through the floor? 

Good luck Viking players.  If the Vulcans beat you all 44-21 then I hope all of the football players protest the athletic director. 

[Que82]

Let me put it simple...there is a big a*s hole in the top of the press box where the coaches have to coach from. They put boards over it to cover it up for the CIAA teams...which was ok...but that won't work for a NCAA game...the school made the right call...a 4 vs. 5 match up is a wash...if we were talking of a 6 vs 3 then maybe you would have a point...they have the money to fix it...(state school, not private) just not the time to get it done before the game...

So are they too embarrassed to say 'Our press box doesn't meet the standard required for an NCAA playoff game'?  They have to use words like equity?  Why was it okay for the CIAA teams?  You all weren't worried about other CIAA coaches falling through the floor? 

Good luck Viking players.  If the Vulcans beat you all 44-21 then I hope all of the football players protest the athletic director. 

If they lose by that margin, then location is not an issue IMHO. 

[westcoastaggie]

This is being blown way out of proportion.